Wow what a huge surprise

....not

Posted: May 11 2006, 09:49 AM
http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/nati...erecords11.html


and before hett gets here it is of course a hugely liberally biased newspaper and i could really give a shit about that thumbs.gif
Posted: May 11 2006, 10:56 AM
Here it is from USA Today:

NSA has massive database of Americans' phone calls
The National Security Agency has been secretly collecting the phone call records of tens of millions of Americans, using data provided by AT&T, Verizon and BellSouth, people with direct knowledge of the arrangement told USA TODAY.

The NSA program reaches into homes and businesses across the nation by amassing information about the calls of ordinary Americans most of whom aren't suspected of any crime. This program does not involve the NSA listening to or recording conversations. But the spy agency is using the data to analyze calling patterns in an effort to detect terrorist activity, sources said in separate interviews.
http://www.usatoday.com/news/washington/2006-05-10-nsa_x.htm

This post has been edited by jake on May 11 2006, 10:58 AM

Posted: May 11 2006, 11:06 AM
I'm glad
I use Sprint


hate for Gwubya
to see all those
900 numbers drink.gif
Posted: May 11 2006, 11:51 AM
Can't say i'm suprised. I would guess this has been going one well before 9/11. the NSA has it's hands in pretty much all electronic communication.
Posted: May 11 2006, 11:56 AM
is it surprising that this program started BEFORE Bush was even president?

everyone acts like this is a big, new story... maybe our elected officials should actually do something meaningful and beneficial for our country rather than calling on telephone and oil company executives "to appear before the panel"...


edit: people need to put things in historical context....
the world started before the year 2000....

This post has been edited by Yankee on May 11 2006, 11:59 AM

Posted: May 11 2006, 12:31 PM
QUOTE (Yankee @ May 11 2006, 01:56 PM)
is it surprising that this program started BEFORE Bush was even president?

everyone acts like this is a big, new story... maybe our elected officials should actually do something meaningful and beneficial for our country rather than calling on telephone and oil company executives "to appear before the panel"...


edit: people need to put things in historical context....
the world started before the year 2000....

It's a new story because we're just hearing about it.
Posted: May 11 2006, 12:33 PM
QUOTE (Yankee @ May 11 2006, 11:56 AM)



edit: people need to put things in historical context....
the world started before the year 2000....

1984


People no longer have privacy, it is an illusion. You are being tracked, cataloged, classified and your data is being stored to be used against you when the time arises. Smile always, so those that are watching think you're a happy docile little camper. Or else...
Posted: May 11 2006, 12:35 PM
QUOTE (Spazstic @ May 11 2006, 02:33 PM)
1984


People no longer have privacy, it is an illusion. You are being tracked, cataloged, classified and your data is being stored to be used against you when the time arises. Smile always, so those that are watching think you're a happy docile little camper. Or else...

You know I'm starting to believe Orwell was on to something... sad.gif
Posted: May 11 2006, 12:56 PM
Giving consideration to the fact that the NSA is doing the same thing that hundreds of commercial companies do, it doesn't bother me that they know who I have contact with and when.
Posted: May 11 2006, 01:57 PM
QUOTE (2WarVet @ May 11 2006, 02:56 PM)
Giving consideration to the fact that the NSA is doing the same thing that hundreds of commercial companies do, it doesn't bother me that they know who I have contact with and when.

I'd say the goals of companies and the NSA are a little bit different.
Posted: May 11 2006, 03:28 PM
QUOTE (Yankee @ May 11 2006, 10:56 AM)
is it surprising that this program started BEFORE Bush was even president?

everyone acts like this is a big, new story... maybe our elected officials should actually do something meaningful and beneficial for our country rather than calling on telephone and oil company executives "to appear before the panel"...


edit: people need to put things in historical context....
the world started before the year 2000....

from cnn

QUOTE
Bush's comments came after USA Today reported Thursday that three telecommunication firms provided the National Security Agency with domestic telephone call records from tens of millions of Americans beginning shortly after the attacks on September 11, 2001.
Posted: May 11 2006, 03:36 PM
I think that statement refers to the current project where the NSA is working with the 3 largest phone companies in the country.
Posted: May 11 2006, 08:27 PM
This is why I only communicate by carrier pigeon.
Posted: May 11 2006, 08:39 PM
QUOTE (junkiecosmonaut @ May 11 2006, 09:27 PM)
This is why I only communicate by carrier pigeon.

The pigeons are double agents. wink.gif This really isn't a link, but move your cursor over it just to make sure.
Posted: May 11 2006, 08:48 PM
QUOTE (hairychest @ May 11 2006, 07:39 PM)
The pigeons are double agents. wink.gif This really isn't a link, but move your cursor over it just to make sure.

i did and he's right ohmy.gif ohmy.gif
Posted: May 11 2006, 10:14 PM
QUOTE (ferris @ May 11 2006, 02:35 PM)
You know I'm starting to believe Orwell was on to something... sad.gif

I think Aldous Huxley was on to something...is anyone else starting to feel "Big Brother" breathe down their back? Brave new world has materialized sad.gif
Posted: May 11 2006, 10:38 PM
QUOTE (pcpalct @ May 11 2006, 09:14 PM)
I think Aldous Huxley was on to something...is anyone else starting to feel "Big Brother" breathe down their back? Brave new world has materialized sad.gif

minus the drug induced vacations thumbs.gif
Posted: May 11 2006, 10:40 PM
QUOTE (SIGH @ May 12 2006, 12:38 AM)
minus the drug induced vacations thumbs.gif

a guy can hope... cool.gif
Posted: May 11 2006, 11:48 PM
QUOTE (pcpalct @ May 11 2006, 09:40 PM)
a guy can hope... cool.gif

im gonna guess from your name that you have had a few drug induced vacations anyways thumbs.gif
Posted: May 12 2006, 12:00 AM
QUOTE (SIGH @ May 12 2006, 01:48 AM)
im gonna guess from your name that you have had a few drug induced vacations anyways thumbs.gif

rolleyes.gif
Posted: May 12 2006, 09:53 PM
QUOTE (pcpalct @ May 11 2006, 10:14 PM)
I think Aldous Huxley was on to something...is anyone else starting to feel "Big Brother" breathe down their back? Brave new world has materialized sad.gif

Found this:

Social Critic Neil Postman contrasts the worlds of 1984 and Brave New World in the foreword of his 1986 book Amusing Ourselves to Death thusly:

What Orwell feared were those who would ban books. What Huxley feared was that there would be no reason to ban a book, for there would be no one who wanted to read one. Orwell feared those who would deprive us of information. Huxley feared those who would give us so much that we would be reduced to passivity and egoism. Orwell feared that the truth would be concealed from us. Huxley feared the truth would be drowned in a sea of irrelevance. Orwell feared we would become a captive culture. Huxley feared we would become a trivial culture, preoccupied with some equivalent of the feelies, the orgy porgy, and the centrifugal bumblepuppy. As Huxley remarked in Brave New World Revisited, the civil libertarians and rationalists who are ever on the alert to oppose tyranny "failed to take into account man's almost infinite appetite for distractions." In 1984, Huxley added, people are controlled by inflicting pain. In Brave New World, they are controlled by inflicting pleasure. In short, Orwell feared that what we hate will ruin us. Huxley feared that what we love will ruin us.
Attached Image Attached Image
Posted: May 12 2006, 10:22 PM
QUOTE (Spazstic @ May 12 2006, 11:53 PM)
Found this:

Social Critic Neil Postman contrasts the worlds of 1984 and Brave New World in the foreword of his 1986 book Amusing Ourselves to Death thusly:

What Orwell feared were those who would ban books. What Huxley feared was that there would be no reason to ban a book, for there would be no one who wanted to read one. Orwell feared those who would deprive us of information. Huxley feared those who would give us so much that we would be reduced to passivity and egoism. Orwell feared that the truth would be concealed from us. Huxley feared the truth would be drowned in a sea of irrelevance. Orwell feared we would become a captive culture. Huxley feared we would become a trivial culture, preoccupied with some equivalent of the feelies, the orgy porgy, and the centrifugal bumblepuppy. As Huxley remarked in Brave New World Revisited, the civil libertarians and rationalists who are ever on the alert to oppose tyranny "failed to take into account man's almost infinite appetite for distractions." In 1984, Huxley added, people are controlled by inflicting pain. In Brave New World, they are controlled by inflicting pleasure. In short, Orwell feared that what we hate will ruin us. Huxley feared that what we love will ruin us.

I think that sort of sums it up.
Posted: May 12 2006, 10:56 PM
QUOTE (jake @ May 11 2006, 01:57 PM)
I'd say the goals of companies and the NSA are a little bit different.

Regardless, it's an invasion of privacy in either case.
Posted: May 12 2006, 10:57 PM
Who pooted?
Posted: May 13 2006, 05:50 AM
QUOTE (2WarVet @ May 13 2006, 12:56 AM)
Regardless, it's an invasion of privacy in either case.

True- but you are giving the companies your information, whereas we are now just hearing about the government getting it secretly. A lawsuit against these phone companies will probably be filed within a couple weeks. Whether or not you care if the government is getting your phone records, Americans have an expectation of privacy from government intrusion in these cases. I can tell you that even as a police officer, phone companies won't give me ANY information about an account unless either the owner of the account calls and authorizes the release of the info, or I get a court order. The "if you don't have anything to hide, you shouldn't care" mentality is a really dangerous slippery slope. Doing these things on a blanket level, and without court orders (which aren't that much of an inconvenience,) removes the checks and balances which ensure our civil rights.