Everyone should watch this. It's brilliant.
http://www.zeitgeistmovie.com
I warn that it's also something like 2 hrs long.
Interesting?
I think so.
Everyone should watch this. It's brilliant.
http://www.zeitgeistmovie.com
I warn that it's also something like 2 hrs long.
you gotta have faith
Attached Image
QUOTE (empresss @ Jul 22 2007, 07:36 PM)
Everyone should watch this. It's brilliant.
http://www.zeitgeistmovie.com
I warn that it's also something like 2 hrs long.
http://www.zeitgeistmovie.com
I warn that it's also something like 2 hrs long.
yeah i dont think i want to spend 2 hours can you send me the cliff notes
QUOTE (ibbangin @ Jul 23 2007, 07:54 AM)
yeah i dont think i want to spend 2 hours can you send me the cliff notes
Too much info for cliff's notes. They cover the corruption of religion, the US and basically the world in general.
Do they cover the travesty that is socialized health care?
that's a joke right?
If you are trying to defend our current medical system, which I'm not sure if you are, then you have no idea what's going on.
Public Medecine (I don't like the term socialized) has to be done right in order to work, that I concede. Allowing for the public medical system and the private to compete is ideal because it lowers prices and would allow for the wealthy to get the care they are so fond of and for the poor to not die in the street.
If you are trying to defend our current medical system, which I'm not sure if you are, then you have no idea what's going on.
Public Medecine (I don't like the term socialized) has to be done right in order to work, that I concede. Allowing for the public medical system and the private to compete is ideal because it lowers prices and would allow for the wealthy to get the care they are so fond of and for the poor to not die in the street.
Survival of the fittest.
Actually, we just have to get away from this notion that that federal government should "save" everybody. It's not the federal governments job to make sure that people have health insurance. It's not the federal governments job to put money in your pocket, i.e. welfare. In general, people need to take care of them damn selves and not expect anybody else to take care of them. This country is founded on the priciple that anybody can achieve anything, if they work hard enough and stay persistent. The problem is nobody (again, in general) wants to work hard anymore. They all want want want but don't want to do anything for it. You want health insurance? Pay attention in school, get good grades, get a fucking job, stay off crack, and POOF! you'll have health insurance.
Actually, we just have to get away from this notion that that federal government should "save" everybody. It's not the federal governments job to make sure that people have health insurance. It's not the federal governments job to put money in your pocket, i.e. welfare. In general, people need to take care of them damn selves and not expect anybody else to take care of them. This country is founded on the priciple that anybody can achieve anything, if they work hard enough and stay persistent. The problem is nobody (again, in general) wants to work hard anymore. They all want want want but don't want to do anything for it. You want health insurance? Pay attention in school, get good grades, get a fucking job, stay off crack, and POOF! you'll have health insurance.
your argument works if you look at it in a nazi darwinist way. But isn't the United States suppose to take care of it's citizens, albeit rich or poor? What do you say to the poor homeless woman who finds a lump on her breast? I agree, getting rid of privatized medicare is a mistake, but the option should be there for free health care. There is too much business in health at the moment and even middle class families are having trouble getting insurance because of abusive prices.
Again, a hybrid system gives you the best of both worlds.
Again, a hybrid system gives you the best of both worlds.
This post has been edited by CharlieDiaz on Jul 24 2007, 12:42 AM
I don't think the current system is perfect, but I believe in capitalism. And capitalism will eventually bring privatized medicine back in line. As for the homeless woman with the lump on her breast, why is she homeless? Why doesn't she have a job? Maybe if she would have laid off the booze and not gotten fired from her job, she could have health insurance. Call me an asshole or whatever, but that's the way I feel. Individuals are responsible for themselves, their actions, and their predicaments. It is not the rold of the federal government to save them or look out for them or make decisions for them. Is that necessarily fair? No. But life will always be one thing, guaranteed, and that is unfair.
QUOTE (JERK @ Jul 24 2007, 12:11 AM)
Do they cover the travesty that is socialized health care?
No. They used that time to show the similarities between Mr. Bush and Hitler.
QUOTE (JERK @ Jul 24 2007, 12:45 AM)
I don't think the current system is perfect, but I believe in capitalism. And capitalism will eventually bring privatized medicine back in line. As for the homeless woman with the lump on her breast, why is she homeless? Why doesn't she have a job? Maybe if she would have laid off the booze and not gotten fired from her job, she could have health insurance. Call me an asshole or whatever, but that's the way I feel. Individuals are responsible for themselves, their actions, and their predicaments. It is not the rold of the federal government to save them or look out for them or make decisions for them. Is that necessarily fair? No. But life will always be one thing, guaranteed, and that is unfair.
Listen, I'm a fan of capitalism as much as the next guy. But there has to be capitalism and government regulation in order for the former to work. There already is public schools, public police, public everything...except health care. Now there are private schools, and there are private investigators, why can't we follow this example with our health system?
Again I don't want to sound unpatriotic but we are being beat by every western industrialized country statistically because we still have this outdated system. I only see it getting worse btw. I dunno what you mean by capitalism will bring it back in line.
QUOTE (CharlieDiaz @ Jul 24 2007, 01:39 AM)
Again, a hybrid system gives you the best of both worlds.
ummm...we do have a hybrid system. It's called Medicaid and Medicare.
Also I'm sorry for getting off topic, I saw the first half of the video and it's very interesting but also possibly very controversial because of all the Jesus disproving...
QUOTE (CharlieDiaz @ Jul 24 2007, 11:14 AM)
Listen, I'm a fan of capitalism as much as the next guy. But there has to be capitalism and government regulation in order for the former to work. There already is public schools, public police, public everything...except health care. Now there are private schools, and there are private investigators, why can't we follow this example with our health system?
Again I don't want to sound unpatriotic but we are being beat by every western industrialized country statistically because we still have this outdated system. I only see it getting worse btw. I dunno what you mean by capitalism will bring it back in line.
Again I don't want to sound unpatriotic but we are being beat by every western industrialized country statistically because we still have this outdated system. I only see it getting worse btw. I dunno what you mean by capitalism will bring it back in line.
I don't think the federal government should be involved in education. I think individual states need to handle that on their own. Funding, regulation, everything.
Police agencies are funded by local governments (except the FBI and US Marshals). No federal funding should go towards state or local cops.
What I meant by capitalism bringing health care back in line is that capitalism is a self-righting system. Everybody wants to make money, but an underlying theme in a capitalist society is the socio-economic responsibilities that large corporations (i.e. drug companies) ultimately have.
No matter what type of health care system there is, somebody, somewhere, will get the short end of the stick. That's life. It isn't all sunshine and roses.
QUOTE (JERK @ Jul 24 2007, 12:25 AM)
Survival of the fittest.
Actually, we just have to get away from this notion that that federal government should "save" everybody. It's not the federal governments job to make sure that people have health insurance. It's not the federal governments job to put money in your pocket, i.e. welfare. In general, people need to take care of them damn selves and not expect anybody else to take care of them. This country is founded on the priciple that anybody can achieve anything, if they work hard enough and stay persistent. The problem is nobody (again, in general) wants to work hard anymore. They all want want want but don't want to do anything for it. You want health insurance? Pay attention in school, get good grades, get a fucking job, stay off crack, and POOF! you'll have health insurance.
Actually, we just have to get away from this notion that that federal government should "save" everybody. It's not the federal governments job to make sure that people have health insurance. It's not the federal governments job to put money in your pocket, i.e. welfare. In general, people need to take care of them damn selves and not expect anybody else to take care of them. This country is founded on the priciple that anybody can achieve anything, if they work hard enough and stay persistent. The problem is nobody (again, in general) wants to work hard anymore. They all want want want but don't want to do anything for it. You want health insurance? Pay attention in school, get good grades, get a fucking job, stay off crack, and POOF! you'll have health insurance.
Very well said you JERK!
QUOTE (JERK @ Jul 24 2007, 12:25 AM)
Survival of the fittest.
Actually, we just have to get away from this notion that that federal government should "save" everybody. It's not the federal governments job to make sure that people have health insurance. It's not the federal governments job to put money in your pocket, i.e. welfare. In general, people need to take care of them damn selves and not expect anybody else to take care of them. This country is founded on the priciple that anybody can achieve anything, if they work hard enough and stay persistent. The problem is nobody (again, in general) wants to work hard anymore. They all want want want but don't want to do anything for it. You want health insurance? Pay attention in school, get good grades, get a fucking job, stay off crack, and POOF! you'll have health insurance.
Actually, we just have to get away from this notion that that federal government should "save" everybody. It's not the federal governments job to make sure that people have health insurance. It's not the federal governments job to put money in your pocket, i.e. welfare. In general, people need to take care of them damn selves and not expect anybody else to take care of them. This country is founded on the priciple that anybody can achieve anything, if they work hard enough and stay persistent. The problem is nobody (again, in general) wants to work hard anymore. They all want want want but don't want to do anything for it. You want health insurance? Pay attention in school, get good grades, get a fucking job, stay off crack, and POOF! you'll have health insurance.
Post appreciation
That, in essence, is the major difference between our political parties. Democrats want to institute all these programs that make the federal government responsible for taking care of people, which in turn raises taxes and makes the government bigger. Republicans want those programs or choices to be left to individuals, or worst case scenario, to the local or state goverments, reducing the size of the federal government and keeping costs lower, which reduces the need for higher taxes. I personally side with the Republican party, mainly for that basic principle. I want to be the one responsible to make sure I have a retirement plan, I want to be the one to make sure I have medical coverage that is sufficient, I want to be the one that makes sure I have a damn job, and so on.
What is sad is that in California, an active duty Marine in the E-1 to E-4 pay grades takes home less money than someone on welfare. That is absolutely ridiculous. And that is including the housing allowance that those Marines would receive if they were living off base. And even though I would love for our younger guys to make more money, I'm not lobbying for it. The problem I have is that why is that fucker on welfare making more for sitting on their ass than the kid that is training and preparing to defend the country?
What is sad is that in California, an active duty Marine in the E-1 to E-4 pay grades takes home less money than someone on welfare. That is absolutely ridiculous. And that is including the housing allowance that those Marines would receive if they were living off base. And even though I would love for our younger guys to make more money, I'm not lobbying for it. The problem I have is that why is that fucker on welfare making more for sitting on their ass than the kid that is training and preparing to defend the country?
QUOTE (CharlieDiaz @ Jul 24 2007, 12:17 AM)
Public Medecine (I don't like the term socialized) has to be done right in order to work, that I concede. Allowing for the public medical system and the private to compete is ideal because it lowers prices and would allow for the wealthy to get the care they are so fond of and for the poor to not die in the street.
The problem with your theory is that there would no longer incentive for doctors to continue working in the public system. The federal government already imposes salary caps which inturn causes doctors to close their (public) practices. The quality of public health care structure would decline rapidly under a two-tiered system. Similar ideas have been thrown around up here for years.